Session Start: Sat Jan 14 13:34:26 2006 Session Ident: #nonprophets [13:34] * Now talking in #nonprophets [13:34] * ChanServ sets mode: +ntr [13:34] * ChanServ changes topic to 'Tune in to the next LIVE Non-Prophets show, Saturday, January 14th, 2006! at 3:00 PM EST on http://www.freethoughtradio.com, or visit http://www.nonprophetsradio.com for archived episodes. (Non-Prophets)' [13:34] * ChanServ sets mode: -ahoq Non-Prophets Non-Prophets Non-Prophets Non-Prophets [13:34] * ChanServ sets mode: +oq Non-Prophets Non-Prophets [13:34] -> *chanserv* topic #nonprophets Tune in to hear the Non-Prophets LIVE, today at 3:00 PM EST on http://www.freethoughtradio.com! -- The last live show of 2005! [13:34] * ChanServ changes topic to 'Tune in to hear the Non-Prophets LIVE, today at 3:00 PM EST on http://www.freethoughtradio.com! -- The last live show of 2005! (Non-Prophets)' [13:54] * ouini has joined #nonprophets [13:59] What are the odds of a live show today? [13:59] We are live [13:59] go to http://nonprophetsradio.com to see how to connect today. [14:00] you can't get in through freethoughtradio [14:00] * naut has joined #nonprophets [14:00] Gotcha. My bad. [14:01] (Loud and clear. Emphasis on loud.) [14:01] Chat hosted by irc.wikkedwire.com [14:01] Visit the Atheist Community of Austin website: http://www.atheist-community.org [14:01] * zippyapparition has joined #nonprophets [14:01] Visit the Non-Prophets website: http://www.nonprophetsradio.com [14:01] Welcome! Freethought Radio isn't broadcasting, but you can connect directly to the LIVE show! Winamp, media player and other software can be used by "connect to URL" or "play URL" features and directing the player to: nonprophets.gotdns.org:8000 [14:02] * naut has quit IRC (naut) [14:03] * bnem has joined #nonprophets [14:03] * bornbare has joined #nonprophets [14:04] * bornbare has quit IRC (Goodbye) [14:04] * Dave63 has joined #nonprophets [14:04] * bornbare has joined #nonprophets [14:07] may be this is viral marketing for the Mel Gibson movie [14:08] ? [14:09] I think Mel Gibson movie has something to do with the Incas or someting like that [14:09] * torrez has joined #nonprophets [14:10] I think the panthers is a symbol of one of their gods [14:10] * torrez has quit IRC (torrez) [14:10] I have no idea what you're talking about... [14:10] Are you listening to our show? :) [14:10] getting rid of the panther statue [14:11] what panther statue? [14:11] Perhaps the chatroom aspect of the show should be named "The Non-Sequiters" [14:12] hmm I might be listening to a previous episode -- what is the address of the current stream [14:12] Welcome! Freethought Radio isn't broadcasting, but you can connect directly to the LIVE show! Winamp, media player and other software can be used by "connect to URL" or "play URL" features and directing the player to: nonprophets.gotdns.org:8000 [14:13] oops your also on shoucast :Now Playing: the non-prophets 2.10 [14:13] I notice the change on the web page - Thanks [14:13] Evidently, that didn't get updated on shoutcast - sorry. [14:14] Okay, that's frikken' hilarious. [14:14] I'll make a note to look into the shoutcast issue. It's supposed to update automatically when we start broadcasting again. I have no idea why an older show would be playing unless someone else is doing it. :( [14:15] ummm It may be the AN [14:15] I didnt know Jake got on shoutcast [14:16] A lot of religious people point to everything else in nature to show God's marvelous design, but the human body, the pinnacle of God's creation, must be covered up. What? [14:17] I think I know why Dave [14:17] If God exists, and the human body is really the pinnacle of his creation... [14:18] So, if you didn't just hear an announcement that this is a LIVE JAN 14 SHOW, then you're hearing an old show. [14:18] Then, logically, to display it in public would provide incontrovertable proof of God's existence, which would be bad - so wear clothes! [14:19] Creationists should be running around saying, "Of course there's a God; just look at my marvelous Johnson!" [14:19] lol [14:20] * ThinkFest has joined #nonprophets [14:21] My gall bladder isn't essential to life. While evolutionists may claim it's a remnant from the evolutionary process - I know that it's really just God's way of signing his work. [14:23] Gall bladders produce the luck enzyme. When you do what God wants you to do, it squishes and injects you with a chemical that makes things happen for you. That's how praying for more money or for somebody to date you works. [14:24] Ooh, ooh, do we priviledged chat roomers get an insight to the 'secret theme'? [14:24] Wow, that's so obvious, who could I have missed it?! Save me, Jesus! (again) [14:24] er, who=how [14:25] I had to have my large intestine (and appendix) removed because my own immune system was attacking it. If I hadn't had it removed, I'd be dead. How's that for design? [14:25] It's an intelligence that you're just too stupid to see. :) [14:26] Maybe your large intestine was plotting to jump up and strangle your brain. [14:26] Dave: That's really amazing. How did you figure out anything was wrong at all? Just, like, generic 'ow...'? [14:27] was it full blown colitis [14:27] Just like eveybody else, I'm doing everything I can to stay out of heaven as long as possible :-) [14:28] I've got hayfever. I'm allergic to plants and the air that passes over them. [14:28] Results inconclusive between Crohn's and Ulcerative Colitis. Seems to be more like Colitis. [14:28] I have colitis, I am taking immune suppressors. [14:29] Yeah, I had another Christian tell me (this week) that because I used to be a Christian, I'm still going to Heaven. So I asked him, "So, what you're saying is that there may be some completely good, philanthropic, selfless person who's going to burn in hell forever because he never believed in Jesus - but I get to go because I spent a few years never really questioning it and the rest of my life arguing against such nonsense? What kind of God is that?" [14:30] I took immune supressors until they stopped working, and then steroids until they stopped working. I don't mean to scare you. I don't think that's a typical case. [14:31] Its ok I usually get a colonoscopy, about every 1 to 2 years :( [14:31] Alito should take a cue from Ginsberg, who was very straightforward about her opinions (especially about her position on abortion) in front of the senate. This straightforwardness was appreciated by republicans, who helped confirm her. The dirty open secret is that conservatives are gleeful about his nomination (wrt its consequences on abortion). that much is clear, based on the lack of squall... [14:31] link coming up .... kazimskorner.blogspot.com [14:32] ...compared to the Harriett Myers nomination. [14:32] Russell's blog [14:32] I'd like my entire immune system temporarily eliminated, to re-set it. [14:37] Behe's position seems to be that, for example "there's can't be a natural explanation for the little motor that drives the flagellum in a bacteria". Therefore, we should just stop looking for an explanation, right? It would be the end of science. [14:39] Argument from "Nuh-uh." [14:40] More about Behe (not Sharon): Before Einstein, Newton's theory of gravity explained the motion of all planets except Mercury. So, obviously, there was no known natural explanation, therefore GOD moved Mercury, right? If we had stopped looking for an explanation, Einstein never would have found one. [14:41] Was Einstein looking for an explanation to Mercury's movement when he figured out special relativity? Or was the explanation just a spin-off of that? [14:41] Robertson Ale : Tast great and 50% less evil [14:42] I think the explanation for Mercury was a fortunate side effect, not the driving motivation. [14:43] Some Christians think they're not supposed to drink beer. I know a Jehova's Witness who brews his own! [14:43] There are things we don't know. They're like open gaps in a jigsaw puzzle. You can label a piece 'God' and drop it into the open regions, but it never 'fits', it merely obstructs the placement of the actual pieces. [14:44] Oh! that reminds me-- anybody know what Muslim people do for vinegar? They're forbidden to drink alcohol or anything that supports its production. Small amounts are taboo too. [14:44] I was making a recipe with 'imitation almond extract' and a Muslim girl informed me she can't eat cookies made with that. [14:45] I dont know maybe olive oil? [14:46] What if you decide to become a Muslim, but you've already had vinegar? Do they have forgiveness? [14:46] And now...on to today's theme! --- Religion in Court! [14:47] http://muslim-canada.org/printletter14.html (vinegar is not forbidden. Internet answer, though, so take it with a grain of salt) [14:51] Even according to the Jesus story, hundreds of people stood face to face with Jesus and thought he was nothing more than a man. So, two thousand years later, why should any of us think otherwise? [14:53] Because of the space aliens. [14:54] Non-Prophets: Do you listen to Infidel Guy's Bible Geek Show? [14:54] I think it's too late at this point to say one way or another whether Jesus existed. The fact that he's a "no show" for the Second Coming indicates that the extraordinary stories about him aren't true. [14:54] Well, according to Father Righi's argument, there's overwhelming testimony to Allah's, Zeus', etc etc existences in various religious and secular texts. Millions had in any case believed in (whomever) as deity for 1,000 to 3000 years. [14:56] bnem - No, I haven't listend to it. [14:56] * ThinkFest has quit IRC (ThinkFest) [14:56] * ThinkFest has joined #nonprophets [14:57] The Liberty Foundation? [14:57] Bible Geek is a great program [14:57] Non-Prophets: yes lots of details and good story telling [14:58] It's on my "to listen" list...I'm just swamped. Some of the other guys may have listened. [14:59] Couldn't you test the effects of prayer on flips of a coin? What are the results? To what degree does God intervene? [14:59] I do this show every other week, the TV show every week, and I'm busy with other ACA events - in addition to all of my "regular life" stuff. I do have Monday off though, maybe I'll dig up some re-runs while doing some writing. Thanks for the tip though [15:00] * Dale has joined #nonprophets [15:00] Chat hosted by irc.wikkedwire.com [15:00] Visit the Atheist Community of Austin website: http://www.atheist-community.org [15:01] Visit the Non-Prophets website: http://www.nonprophetsradio.com [15:01] Listen LIVE at http://www.freethoughtradio.com [15:01] 0---- er, ignore that one, they're taking the month off :) [15:01] Welcome! Freethought Radio isn't broadcasting, but you can connect directly to the LIVE show! Winamp, media player and other software can be used by "connect to URL" or "play URL" features and directing the player to: nonprophets.gotdns.org:8000 [15:01] The Bibler Geek is a great show, but it would be a lot more useful if each show had a list of questions answered. Then you could "random access" the shows for specific information. [15:01] The effects of prayer would be meaningless without a "causal link". In a lottery, *somebody* wins and most lottery winners are theists. Without a "causal link" we just have a "correlation". Could be prayer; could be coincidence. [15:02] ThinkFest - I'd agree, though I think that the example you chose demonstrates a problem with perception - and doesn't address that we could quantify the per-capita statistical significance. [15:03] (expelled student): A similar case, in Kentucky I think, happened a couple years ago. A private business fired a woman based solely on the fact that her picture had been published in the paper, when she attended a gay-pride event, wearing an "I can't even think straight" Tee-shirt. Their right to fire her for that was upheld. If the school is private, I predict she'll lose. [15:04] It's definitely a good way to point out how easily statistics can be mis-used and "correlation" is only meaningful in the right context...and on that front, it's a great point. [15:04] We used to have a Skeptic's Club at the University of Texas, and "Couldn't you just do a study with some people praying?" used to come up alot. [15:05] Yup [15:05] I tried to invent a way to pray that was "double-blind". So, the subjects would pray but they wouldn't know if they were praying to a God or to the control. [15:06] And they have done those studies...unfortunately, the efficacy of prayer is continually refuted by the results. (Despite occasional claims to the contrary) [15:06] The typical response from Xians?.... [15:06] Thou shalt not put the LORD they God to the test. [15:06] grrr they=thy [15:06] Typical response I've heard was, "But THIS study showed prayer WORKED." [15:06] I'm in "typo" mode today [15:06] They've done such studies, I think. Third-party pray-ers were told whom to pray for, but not the condition of the pray-ees. [15:07] There are some studies that showed a correlation. :) [15:07] Initially, but every one I've seen which was challenged, demonstrated failures in methodology - you just don't see _that_ part of the story reported as much. [15:07] ouini: How did the condition of the pray-ees affect it I wonder? [15:07] God can do anything, just DON'T put Him to the test. How convenient. [15:08] Yeah, I'm always baffled by how Xians reconcile that. You've got several verses which imply "I'll give you whatever you ask for" and others which imply "Don't ask for anything, God will do what he wants" [15:09] Oh well, that's hardly the only contradiction they have to rationalize away. :)_ [15:09] If you ask for something, it implies God won't do it unless you ask, so YOU must know better than HE does. [15:10] And the LORD spake, "I'm omniscient, but just in case I missed something, let me know. Thanks!" [15:11] * Dave63 laughs out loud [15:11] hehe! [15:15] Denis didn't mention the next part of the article (yet?) which states that this was actually a usefull tool *for* Action, Wisconsin -- they're gearing up to fight a November anti gay-marriage ballot initiative. They're showing how insane the kind of people who are proposing it are. [15:16] Action, Wisconsin. Cool. I'm going to try to get my town changed to Action, Pennsylvania. [15:16] Good point...but I don't think we'll get to that today. I'll let the guys know. (You're on a delay and I'm trying to keep us from back-tracking too much) :) [15:18] * ouini rolls on the floor,laughing [15:18] This Posner judge kicks ass. Good reading, Jeff. [15:21] Act of lewdness? What, was he was going to read the Bible? [15:26] God will help you get an "A" on your next test, but he won't rescue buried coal miners. [15:27] We had a lot of fun today! Thanks everyone...we'll be Live again on the 28th!!!! [15:27] -> *chanserv* topic #nonprophets Tune in to the next LIVE Non-Prophets show, Saturday, January 28th, 2006! at 3:00 PM EST on http://www.freethoughtradio.com, or visit http://www.nonprophetsradio.com for archived episodes. [15:27] * ChanServ changes topic to 'Tune in to the next LIVE Non-Prophets show, Saturday, January 28th, 2006! at 3:00 PM EST on http://www.freethoughtradio.com, or visit http://www.nonprophetsradio.com for archived episodes. (Non-Prophets)' [15:28] Hey, it's only :28 after the hour! where are you going? [15:28] * bornbare has left #nonprophets [15:28] bye NP [15:28] Gotta run, see you all in 2 weeks --- Matt [15:28] Just kidding. Bye! [15:28] See ya. [15:28] * Dale has quit IRC (Dale) [15:28] * bnem has quit IRC (using sirc version 2.211+KSIRC/1.3.12) [15:28] * Disconnected Session Close: Sat Jan 14 15:28:43 2006